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Regulations for Passenger Carrying 7.25" railways

jeggray

Joined: 11-11-15

Topics: 2

Replies: 8

Posted: Sat 30th Jan 2016, 9:39am
Regulations for Passenger Carrying 7.25" railways

I am new to the Society. I want to build 300m of 7.25" in my garden. IS HSG 216 not applicable any more? If not, what has replaced it?
 

Replies To This Post

Xz

Joined: 1-01-92

Topics: 17

Replies: 244

Posted: Sat 30th Jan 2016, 12:17pm

Welcome Jeggray. HSG216 is all we have; it has not been updated, or superseded, as far as I know, for many years. The story behind that is complicated. If you can obtain a copy I would work to it as best you are able.

In your own garden you may more or less do what you please if you are not carrying members of the public or charging for rides.

Bob Gray
 

jeggray

Joined: 11-11-15

Topics: 2

Replies: 8

Posted: Sat 30th Jan 2016, 1:00pm

Thanks Bob. Jeg replying: I will want to have 'Open Days' where I can be raising money for local charities. Sort of Train rides and a cream tea, so there hopefully will be occasions when the public is on the railway and other parts of my garden. I am looking for specific advice on, for example, how close I can lay track to a wall, what width and height measurements are required for a tunnel and bridges, what width of not yet built stone shed will I need to lay three roads with a turntable outside, also how far apart tracks have to be to permit passing trains. I will see if I can get a copy of HSG216 from the internet; what I have glanced at wasn't as specific as I wanted. Thanks again for your reply.
 

Xz

Joined: 1-01-92

Topics: 17

Replies: 244

Posted: Sat 30th Jan 2016, 2:12pm

Jeg, perhaps a chat with Arnold Gorse over at Stavely-in-Cartmel might be helpful. He does similar things with his railway there.

Best of luck with it all.
 

jeggray

Joined: 11-11-15

Topics: 2

Replies: 8

Posted: Sat 30th Jan 2016, 2:56pm

Jeg Replying: Yes, thanks for this. I have spoken with Arnold during his public open days and I will contact him again perhaps on one of his Sunday Afternoon Volunteering times. I understand he has managed to buy the woods along the woodland edge of his existing layout and may well be advancing his plans to extend. As you might know, the existing track (of about one mile) is more or less on the same level and he will have new challenges with some 'proper' civil engineering ! My site is 250' long and 22' wide at one end and 45' wide at the other. Challenges there for stock straight away. Also the base Station level and Carriage Shed will be approx 10' lower than the top area, so more challenges there. I need to read up on (and would welcome tips on) how to incorporate gradients, but don't want to zig-zag. I will have to peck through living rock to install a tunnel, rising and on a curve- more challenges there! Meanwhile I have ordered a copy of HSG 216 to see what guidelines there have been.
 

jeggray

Joined: 11-11-15

Topics: 2

Replies: 8

Posted: Thu 25th Feb 2016, 7:47pm

I've now got and read a copy of HSG 216. It covers all the necessary but does not give measurements of recommended gaps, spaces, heights etc but rather uses words like appropriate, adequate and suitable. I found it common sense really and pretty obvious if you understand anything about Health and Safety. Still, as I was once told, the obvious is often not obvious until it is stated!
 

frankcooper

Joined: 9-08-09

Topics: 9

Replies: 57

Posted: Fri 26th Feb 2016, 8:15am

The recommended clearance at ground level is 600mm either side of track. This increases to 1000mm if a deep cutting or tunnel side.
 

HauteSaoneFrance

Joined: 2-01-14

Topics: 27

Replies: 91

Posted: Fri 26th Feb 2016, 7:49pm

OMG Jeggray, I never gave a thought to 'regulation' for a garden railway and mine is in that home of bureaucracy "France" the intention is that it's only for private consumption but being on the edge of a very small village and being urged by friends to do something like a summer BBQ open day to network with the locals I'm wondering how many laws I might be breaking if the railway is not at a complete "Halt" for the duration?

 

jeggray

Joined: 11-11-15

Topics: 2

Replies: 8

Posted: Sat 27th Feb 2016, 9:33am

Thanks for this Frank. Whose recommendation is this? I understand that there needs to be 'adequate' room for passengers to alight in a breakdown situation,especially on a bridge or in a tunnel) but surely this does not need to be on both sides of the track? Given that the ballast trench will not be this wide, the ground is likely to consist of the ballast trench in the middle and mud(in a tunnel) or grass in cuttings. How wide should the ballast trench be, and how deep?

Also to HauteSaoneFrance: HSG 216 was issued by the UK Health and Safety Executive. It may be that you consider its common sense suggestions / guidelines would be appropriate worldwide. It may be a good idea to get in touch with the relevant French Authority or at least seek guidance from a local miniature railway club. No such club in Thollon Les Memises, Haute Savoie, I'm afraid.
 

nickburton

Joined: 2-06-09

Topics: 4

Replies: 6

Posted: Sat 27th Feb 2016, 8:40pm

The story of Bently Minature Railway booklet "Change Here for a Walk in the Woods" is a good value practical guide. Guilford MES website has a useful loading gauge. The appropriate part of Brian Hollingsworth's Model Railroads is also useful, but it is only 1 chapter.
 

HauteSaoneFrance

Joined: 2-01-14

Topics: 27

Replies: 91

Posted: Sat 27th Feb 2016, 11:37pm

After reading HSG 216 I'm beginning to think I should have taken up rose growing or bee keeping as a hobby, no doubt even those pursuits would need a risk assessment?
 

frankcooper

Joined: 9-08-09

Topics: 9

Replies: 57

Posted: Mon 29th Feb 2016, 10:31am

This is a HSE suggested clearance. Your insurers would also be looking at this in the event of an incident.
 

Slowcoach

Joined: 1-01-77

Topics: 2

Replies: 12

Posted: Sat 18th Jun 2016, 6:51am

Jeg,

I've just had a similar thread in the infrastructure section of the forum (See Loading Gauge). I looked at my copy of TN 3 (precursor of HSG 216) and found Appendix B a good starting point. However, reading the text and thinking about the words as well will give you a feel for what is required. And go to club tracks where they do public running making sure you ask the person responsible such a the Chief Engineer. And get someone like that to come along and look at your planned arrangements and the finished line. The experienced and independent eye would be very valuable.
TN 3 and HSG 216 were developed and issued because of the proliferation of commercial railways of gauges below Standard Gauge in the 1980s.
Remember: there's nowt so daft as folk - if it's possible to do something stupid. there's a member of the public who'll do it.

Hope this posting is in time and of value.

Jack (Member 191)
 
 
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